Mashaba Hints at Mayoral Bid, Refuses to Back Zille
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JEREMY MAGGS: Let’s start with the current political scene. With next year’s local government elections approaching, ActionSA leader Herman Mashaba seems to be fully engaging in the race for Johannesburg. He indicates his party may look into a partnership with the Democratic Alliance (DA), but only under strict conditions, emphasizing that the DA’s past associations have adversely affected its appeal to black voters.
Mashaba is pushing for what he refers to as black excellence, signaling that the ANC (African National Congress) might turn to him to help prevent Helen Zille from securing a position in city hall. Herman Mashaba joins me on the show now.
Welcome, Herman. There are reports that suggest you’re amenable to a coalition with the DA in Johannesburg. Can you share what may have changed since you asserted those affiliations hurt your party’s support?
HERMAN MASHABA: Thank you, Jeremy, and good afternoon to our listeners. I want to clarify that I haven’t made any personal commitments. What I’ve communicated is that ActionSA will formally present its Johannesburg candidate at the appropriate time.
I’m prepared to step forward only if we cannot find another Nasiphi Moya. Last year, in Tshwane, I faced significant challenges with the DA for two years regarding services for the townships and had to make the difficult decision to replace them with Dr. Nasiphi Moya, who has achieved remarkable results. I take pride in her work.
Read: ‘GNU should learn from Tshwane budget’: Mashaba
Thus, my candidacy hinges on not discovering a suitable alternative, but I implore the people of Johannesburg to grant us some leeway as the city is in turmoil. The ANC has genuinely been detrimental to the city.
As for the DA, from personal experience, back in 2016, I opted to transfer my business management to my wife to join forces with the DA and remove the ANC, an effort we succeeded in on our first attempt.
However, I encountered pushback from certain DA members who believed I was paying too much attention to poorer communities. It was disheartening to face accusations that my political activism was solely for the party’s benefit.
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I entered politics to serve society, especially the marginalized and the disadvantaged.
I live in Atholl, Sandton, and as I gaze across the freeway at Alexandra, I thought: instead of leaving the country, why not delve into politics? If these ANC representatives can govern, surely I can make a contribution as well. I was unaware of the mayor’s responsibilities back then.
Fast forward to 2021, ActionSA performed well in Tshwane, Ekurhuleni, and Johannesburg, and we made a strategic choice to support the DA in order to thwart the ANC’s return to power. However, the situation in Tshwane left me disappointed.
I’ve learned valuable lessons from my political journey. Initially, I vowed never to associate with the ANC, but the reality is that decision-making belongs to the voters.
JEREMY MAGGS: Herman, it’s tough for me to believe you’re considering working with the DA again given your past challenges. Isn’t this merely a political necessity?
HERMAN MASHABA:No, I’m not suggesting I will work exclusively with the DA.
JEREMY MAGGS: I didn’t say exclusively; I mentioned collaborating with the DA.
HERMAN MASHABA: I’m willing to cooperate with any party if the voters ask for it. For instance, in Johannesburg, a majority requires 272 councillors, and it’s clear no single party will achieve that. We at ActionSA emphasize that we won’t dismiss collaboration outright with the ANC or the DA. The key point is not whether we can work with the DA; it’s about collaborating with any party under the right conditions. The top condition is that corruption must be acknowledged as our public enemy.
We insist on a formal coalition agreement that identifies corruption as public enemy number one.
Secondly, we must pledge to deliver services to all communities, not only to those who supported us. These stipulations are vital if we need to partner with either the DA or the ANC.
Lastly, if the DA genuinely wants to team up with ActionSA, they must unequivocally agree to stop illegal undocumented migrants from entering our city. That forms the context of what I’ve expressed in prior interviews.
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Read: Over 51,000 undocumented migrants have been deported since SA’s GNU was instituted – Schreiber
JEREMY MAGGS: It seems you’ve established a higher standard, particularly regarding requiring DA backing for the deportation of undocumented migrants. How would that be enforced?
HERMAN MASHABA: Absolutely, yes. If they refuse to deport illegal migrants, then we won’t have an alliance because ActionSA is firm on this: all illegal foreigners must return to their home nations.
At present, more than 54% of our citizens struggle for basic essentials, residing in areas devoid of adequate services. It’s perplexing to ponder accommodating billions globally while we can’t even look after our own.
Listen/read: Report: Life in SA is becoming unaffordable for most
For ActionSA, this topic is non-negotiable. Any party seeking our backing must be ready to deport illegal foreigners; otherwise, they are wasting our time—and theirs.
JEREMY MAGGS: There’s speculation that the ANC might depend on you to block Helen Zille from seizing power. Are you comfortable with the idea of being a kingmaker—preventing someone from attaining a position instead of presenting a solid plan?
Read: ANC hindered by numerous ‘kingmakers’ with substantial egos in SA [Oct 2024]
HERMAN MASHABA: We’re ready to collaborate with any party that is open to those three conditions. These conditions are non-negotiable, independent of who it is. We’re not here to obstruct anyone from participating in the election.
We recognize the rights of any South African who wants to contest, whether it be Helen Zille or anyone else, and we won’t work with others to prevent their participation.
JEREMY MAGGS: If you had to choose, who would make a better mayor, Helen Zille or Dada Morero?
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HERMAN MASHABA: Neither. I have no confidence in either candidate.
JEREMY MAGGS: Why not?
HERMAN MASHABA: Dada Morero—just look at the current condition of Johannesburg. As for Helen Zille, she is accountable for the issues we face in this city during my time as mayor.
JEREMY MAGGS: However, you’re open to working with both of their parties, just not with them directly.
HERMAN MASHABA: Absolutely. I hold both candidates in the same regard. In 2019, when I was deep into investigating serious fraud and corruption involving ANC leaders, Helen Zille attempted to engage them to instigate a no-confidence motion against me, claiming she could secure backing from white councillors. To me, that indicates complicity on her part.
Read/listen: GNU at a crossroads? What Zille and the Presidency have to say
JEREMY MAGGS: Finally, how can you contemplate collaborating with the DA or the ANC while dismissing both their mayoral candidates?
HERMAN MASHABA: Jeremy, governing Johannesburg demands 136 out of 270 councillors. If we find ourselves in a coalition—which isn’t uncommon in South Africa or elsewhere—we can work with those around us. I’m not in politics to form personal alliances, but to serve my nation.
In any coalition situation, I will collaborate. Nevertheless, certain principles are non-negotiable, as I’ve outlined for you.
JEREMY MAGGS: Thank you for your time, Herman Mashaba, who leads ActionSA. Tomorrow, we’re set to speak with the DA’s Helen Zille.
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